Curse

mafia cyborg · Feb 02, 2008, 10:52 PM // 22:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

/unsigned

If you like building that much go play magic. thats what the entire gae is about. Its basicaly guild wars only more complicated and with less farming.

what is it?
i might try it....
i wish i could just make level 20 PvE chars with all skills unlocked (and balanced) and go fight,explore,trade etc. that would be the perfect game for me.
but that sure ain't changin.

Sora267 · Feb 02, 2008, 10:57 PM // 22:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by mafia cyborg

what is it?
i might try it....

i also hate levelling in GW....i wish i could just make level 20 PvE chars with all skills unlocked (and balanced) and go fight,explore,trade etc. that would be the perfect game for me.
but that sure ain't changin.

Magic = Magic the Gathering = a card game. It's quite fun, you should try it.

If you hate levelling in GW, try using PvP chars. It's like PvE, but requires more teamwork, has no PvE skills, and is basically made of everything you want in PvE. Random Arenas is KIND of like soloing! :P

DivineEnvoy · Feb 02, 2008, 10:59 PM // 22:59

To be honest, how many of these PvE-only skills are killing the game threads do we need in a week?

[DE] · Feb 02, 2008, 11:01 PM // 23:01

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Originally Posted by Sora of the Divine

Okay, lemme get this straight. You're saying that by ADDING MORE skills, they've LOWERED the selection of skills?

Yes. The more imbalanced skills they add, the less diversity people want.

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And you're saying that it was great that PvE skills were balanced through PvP standards?

PvE skills promote skill less play as opposed to when we actually had reasonably balanced skills.

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And you're not FORCED to max out titles, or FORCED to use the PvE skills. Why do you care what others are doing in PvE? The E stands for environment, not player.

No guild/Limited Friendlist = R10 Ursan LFG. What other way are people going to be able to get into groups?

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And the 3 PvE skills on a bar is a LIMIT, not MANDATORY.

It is a limit but if you can bring 3 overpowered PvE skills there's no reason to only use 1 or 2.

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Also, there's no such thing as "pvp skills". If by "pvp skills", you mean "skills that can be used in PvP", well, lets see:

"all the 100s of pvp skills in the gw game are now almost worthless as they can't compare to how strong these pve are."

He just referred to those skills in the wrong way

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If you were as good in PvE as you SAY you are, you'd know that 3 PvE skills won't constitute a decent bar. You can, nay, SHOULD use these "obsolete pvp skills" to support these PvE skills, and vice versa. And if you're telling me that Ursan Blessing is more powerful than a well-constructed SF build, a decent Curses build, a decent Warrior build, or a 55 Monk in PvE......Let me have some of what you're smoking, please.

Save Yourself + There's Nothing to Fear + Focused Anger. Why do I need anything else on my bar when I can use 2 OP'd PvE skills and 1 decent elite? Or I could just bring ursan and have one skill on my bar.

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Ordinarily, I'd support you because your cause is for PvE, but after seeing how poorly constructed your argument is....

/unsigned for being owned by common sense.

makosi · Feb 02, 2008, 11:06 PM // 23:06

Other than Ursan/Volfen/Raven Blessing, neither of the PvE skills dictate your skillbar so can be as creative as you like. I don't bother with Ursan because I'm not fond of it and I play squish casters most of the time so it isn't appropriate.

I view the PvE skills as tools and fillers instead of must-haves. I enjoy toying with Pain Inverter (wooo yellow numbers) and Technobabble but could manage without them just as I did before.

hurdlebeast · Feb 02, 2008, 11:07 PM // 23:07

i'm /confused. yeah the skills are good, so what. they are balanced out by having to grind for them. the more time you spend playing the game, the more powerful they become. if you don't like them, don't use them. simple as that.

Navaros · Feb 02, 2008, 11:08 PM // 23:08

PVE only skills never ruined a darn thing.

Don't like them? Don't use them. End of story.

ZuRin · Feb 02, 2008, 11:10 PM // 23:10

i find it this simple.........u dont have to use any pve only skills....i have like 2 sunspear skills and 1 luxon skill.....i haven't gotten any of the gwen skills even though i have it....and guess what....i still get into parties...im at no dis-advantage its not about the pve skills its about your build...honestly like others said if it really really bothers u that much dont use them it doesnt bother me im jut lazy so i dont have them.....to put it simple gw is a game that is BALANCED so clearly theres nothing wrong with these pve only skills have u ever seen anet nerf a pve only skill b4 gwen....no....so why would they do it now....doesnt make sense...they wont nerf them because there PVE ONLY...they only nerf skills that effect the whole game that includes pvp so since u cant use pve skills in pvp its not gonna happen....so i think thats logical enough....

Truly Your Zu Rin

p.s stop bitchin' and just play...gw is just a game so get over it

Serac · Feb 02, 2008, 11:41 PM // 23:41

Very /unsigned.
Weird incoherent argument.
Furthermore, I like having Vampirism and Summon Spirits in the same bar on my Ritualist.
Stop whining and go grind titles in silence.
Is this a veiled anti-ursan thread?

Sora267 · Feb 02, 2008, 11:47 PM // 23:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Phantom

Yes. The more imbalanced skills they add, the less diversity people want.

I interpreted the way he said it as ANet lowering the selection of skills available, not society's desire of diversity decreasing. If people want less diversity...Look for the right people. It's not too hard to find a nice non-ZOMG-URSAN-DOOD-DOOD guild.

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PvE skills promote skill less play as opposed to when we actually had reasonably balanced skills.

I'm going to assume you mean less GROUP play, in which case, there were always those sociopaths who wouldn't do group play either way.

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No guild/Limited Friendlist = R10 Ursan LFG. What other way are people going to be able to get into groups?

I've only seen Ursan groups in elite areas, and I've seen group forming with normal builds while an Ursan group was forming. Also, if you've got no guild (Not in between guilds, but just outright refuse to join a guild during your entire GW career) AND a limited friendlist, I don't know what to say to you.

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It is a limit but if you can bring 3 overpowered PvE skills there's no reason to only use 1 or 2.

He's trying to pass himself as an "experienced build maker". If he was, he'd know that that third skill slot could be better used with a non-PvE only skill that synergizes well with the rest of the bar rather than another skill to buttonmash.

[quote]He just referred to those skills in the wrong way[quote]
Got caught up in the moment there.

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Save Yourself + There's Nothing to Fear + Focused Anger. Why do I need anything else on my bar when I can use 2 OP'd PvE skills and 1 decent elite? Or I could just bring ursan and have one skill on my bar.

Not everyone's running a Paragon. Though, I must admit, <3 my Para.

Overall, I kind of get where he's coming from, but he made it sound like you only had a choice between using ONLY normal skills or ONLY PvE-only skills. In reality, you should be able to synergize PvE skills with the other skills on your bar, which is most likely what they were meant for. A different style of synergy for PvE, not to "stop people from QQing".

I think this post sums up my thoughts nicely:

Quote:

Originally Posted by makosi

Other than Ursan/Volfen/Raven Blessing, neither of the PvE skills dictate your skillbar so can be as creative as you like. I don't bother with Ursan because I'm not fond of it and I play squish casters most of the time so it isn't appropriate.

I view the PvE skills as tools and fillers instead of must-haves. I enjoy toying with Pain Inverter (wooo yellow numbers) and Technobabble but could manage without them just as I did before.

anonymous · Feb 02, 2008, 11:58 PM // 23:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by mafia cyborg

but eotn made TIME too much of a decisive factor and has dumbened down the game ruining the "thinking" bits. (thats why maybe some ppl cant undestrand my thread.....maybe their iq has fallen cos of too much EOTN

)

Welcome to PvXwiki. There was never thinking required in PvE and a lot of the people that "think" and make "creative builds" come up with crap like the WoH W/Mo, The Panic R/Me, and the Flare spam N/E.
Making up your own builds is overrated. No one cares if you came up with your own build if an older one is 10 times better. Making your own build is only good if it is better than the old ones.

Sir Pandra Pierva · Feb 03, 2008, 12:03 AM // 00:03

XD currently 38 people viewing this thread

anyway can you please explain how this makes farming harder for you.......

Also magic rocks I play it all the time

Shadowmoon · Feb 03, 2008, 12:03 AM // 00:03

I wonder if the OP doesn't have gwen, and he is complaining about not beng able to pug non gwen areas because people want pve skills. Honestly guildwars is a solo game, hero/hench is all you need outside of the "elite" areas. And many of those are doable with either 2 people and 6 heros, or 1 person and 3 heros.

FakePC · Feb 03, 2008, 12:04 AM // 00:04

nothing is better example of this than URSAN

ursan has taken a game with 10 characters classes and innumerable builds and narrowed it down to 2 ursans and healers

Rhedd · Feb 03, 2008, 12:06 AM // 00:06

I don't usually use PvE skills in PvE, and I certainly don't use three at a time.

I don't feel that I'm at a disadvantage, at all.

When I DO use a PvE skill (usually Great Dwarf Weapon) I want to be able to use it anywhere in PvE that I bloody well please.

I've often wondered why so many people think they'd have more fun if they put limits on other people's fun.

Don't like PvE skills? Don't take them. Have some self control.

[DE] · Feb 03, 2008, 12:07 AM // 00:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sora of the Divine

I'm going to assume you mean less GROUP play, in which case, there were always those sociopaths who wouldn't do group play either way.

Well I was referring to "skill less play" as in being able to mash your skills randomly and generate epic wins. Which is what a lot of PvE skills seem to be quite well at doing.

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I've only seen Ursan groups in elite areas, and I've seen group forming with normal builds while an Ursan group was forming. Also, if you've got no guild (Not in between guilds, but just outright refuse to join a guild during your entire GW career) AND a limited friendlist, I don't know what to say to you.

Well, from my experience it seems that the groups with "normal builds" highly enjoy the classical 1 tank + 5 eles + bonder + monk set-up. I used to clear DoA a few times a week with SMS using 2 paragons + whatever else we could find and I never saw another group being formed that wasn't either the gimmick aggro+nuke build or ursanway. Unfortunately for other people the community for guild wars (like a lot of online games) isn't that great and it's hard to find some competent people that you don't mind adding to your friend list and play with again.

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He's trying to pass himself as an "experienced build maker". If he was, he'd know that that third skill slot could be better used with a non-PvE only skill that synergizes well with the rest of the bar rather than another skill to buttonmash.

I'll be quite honest when I say I never fully read the OP

. I can't decide whether or not he's actually an "experienced build maker or not." I do agree though that if you have a non-PvE only skill that synergizes better with your build than a PvE skill would, than you should take it.

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Not everyone's running a Paragon. Though, I must admit, <3 my Para.

It's pretty sad that you don't see many paragons running around in PvE. They're the most powerful class in the game atm (PvE-wise and they're still strong in PvP), but not many groups are interested in using them.

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Overall, I kind of get where he's coming from, but he made it sound like you only had a choice between using ONLY normal skills or ONLY PvE-only skills. In reality, you should be able to synergize PvE skills with the other skills on your bar, which is most likely what they were meant for. A different style of synergy for PvE, not to "stop people from QQing".

Yes, assuming you're not using a blessing synergizing pve-only skills with regular skills gives you the best of both worlds. However I'm someone that believes PvE would be much better off without PvE-only skills. (And less grind. Please Anet take away grind... I know you need to keep us busy until GW2 Open Beta but cooomee on.....)

artay · Feb 03, 2008, 12:21 AM // 00:21

If your suggestions were implemented, guild wars would implode.

[skill]Echo[/skill] [skill]Mending[/skill]

Miska Bow · Feb 03, 2008, 12:36 AM // 00:36

So is this what we're talking about ?

Ebon Battle Standard of Courage
Ward Spell. You plant an Ebon Battle Standard of Courage at your current location. For 10...20 seconds, non-Spirit allies in this area gain +24 armor and an additional +24 armor against Charr.

Compare to this:

Ward Against Harm

Elite Ward Spell. Create a Ward Against Harm at this location. For 8...18...20 seconds, non-Spirit allies in this area have 12...50...60 armor against fire damage and 12...22...24 armor against other damage.

Where is this Huge advantage you're talking about? If you take the time to look them up carefully, you 'll find that they, for the most part, have a pve/pvp skill counterpart. (meaning none of these skills are kick-ass-lick'em all and mail post them back to their mamas skills) ( Ursan is not a skill, its a blessing... for some)

Have you bought EoTN ? If yes i dont understand your attitude. If not then i can understand your frustrations

Mouse at Large · Feb 03, 2008, 12:38 AM // 00:38

I've been vanquishing with one Guildie. Cantha done, Elona, one to do, Tyria 8 to do. We've never used Ursan, and see no need. I admit we often use a tweaked Sab's setup, but part of the fun is in the tweaking

The skills are there to use as you want. It's your choice to use them in whatever combo you (and others in your group) see fit.

Skyy High · Feb 03, 2008, 01:24 AM // 01:24

I've really never been asked to take a PvE-only skill, by any group, other than an Ursan group. The rest of the time, there's only two PvE only skills that are just that awesome: Pain Inverter and Finish Him!, and you only need one copy of each of those per team. The rest of the skills are either gimmicky, pretty much as good as normal skills, just plain bad, or only marginally better than the alternatives so that it doesn't even really matter.

Oh, and Sunspear Rebirth Sig. But that replaces res sig one for one, so it's not like it leads to huge new builds. If anything, it just reduces the number of PvE skills you can bring to two.